I think you’ve blindly accepted this narrative as dogma without any real evidence and anything that happens you could just twist into supporting the narrative. If Talarico and Hamilton had lost, you’d just say that it shows they were too supportive of trans rights, since they won, you say it’s because they weren’t fully supportive of them. Meanwhile, the example of El-Sayed is just written off because he doesn’t fit the narrative you already decided on. It’s nonsense.
To me, this reaction from the community was a problem.
Both politicians and the community.
Ah, see, there you have it. The community. When people talk about the left going too far, what they mean is almost always like some random Tumblr blog with 10 followers.
Guess what? There are still random Tumblr blogs with 10 followers saying all sorts of crazy things, wielding zero political influence just as they did back then. Fucking, saying crazy shit is part of growing up, part of sorting out ideas, and some of the “crazy shit” that’s taken to represent “the left” is literally just some 15 year old. You’re never going to enforce any kind of “party discipline” across everyone in the country.
What’s changed is not that teenagers suddenly stopped saying crazy shit, or lost the power they never had in the first place, but that the Republicans fucked shit up badly enough that people started having better things to worry about. And to some extent, people have just become more accustomed to the internet and the fact that there are always people saying all kinds of shit and it doesn’t fucking matter. And frankly, the most woke shit by the edgiest teen could barely compete with the shit Elon Musk tweets out regularly to huge audiences anyway.
So, in my opinion, this whole narrative is bullshit based on nothing but memories of perceptions.
If Talarico and Hamilton had lost, you’d just say that it shows they were too supportive of trans rights
Lol, now you’re just making shit up.
As for El Sayed, I’m not saying everybody has gone full anti-woke. I’m just saying the Democratic party has chilled out in general. There’s gonna be exceptions.
So, in my opinion, this whole narrative is bullshit based on nothing but memories of perceptions.
The point is with this sort of narrative that isn’t really based on hard evidence in the first place, virtually anything that happens can be spun to support it, and the inconvenient parts just glossed over. It’s just based on feelings so the only way to refute it is if you just happen to feel differently.
As for El Sayed, I’m not saying everybody has gone full anti-woke. I’m just saying the Democratic party has chilled out in general. There’s gonna be exceptions.
So what you are saying then is that everybody had been woke. Because otherwise, if it’s just that there are some politicians that are woke and some that are anti-woke, and it was like that before, then nothing’s really changed.
But that’s the thing. Not everybody in the party was woke. And if you relied on actual evidence instead of memories and feelings, you’d see that that’s obviously true. If everyone had been woke, that raises the question of why wasn’t there legislation that you can actually point to?
If anything, politicians generally didn’t really talk about trans people or have clearly defined stances, until Republicans decided to make it a central issue of their campaign.
Politics is not always “hard facts” and sometimes it’s just “perception and feelings”. When I saw this meme I had a reaction based on what I have seen over the last 5-10 years. I am one person on the internet. Feel free to ignore me, but also feel free to recognize that I may be representing an opinion shared by many other people that are not commenting on this thread.
I see posts on here all the time and comments on here all the time that collect to give me a perception of the “community”. Along with talking with friends and family. And not only reading headlines about things a politician said, but listening to their actual words. It is not worth it to me to google sources for you for every opinion or perception I have.
You mentioned El Sayed as an example. I saw a headline yesterday praising him for not turning his back on trans people in his 60 minutes interview. I listened to that interview and didn’t hear anything particularly pro trans. He basically said the government doesn’t need to get involved. Which is a great opinion to have.
Do I feel like having it out with you about how “woke” he is as a candidate? Not really. Especially not when it doesn’t matter.
So what you are saying then is that everybody had beenwoke.
The time we’re discussing when the Democrats were supposedly “too woke.” They had the same positions then that you call reasonable now.
You just don’t know it because you don’t care about the facts. The Democratic Party was never “particularly pro-trans” beyond the government staying out of people’s business.
I didn’t want to have to google, but you made me. This article seems to be saying many things I am saying. Democrats went to far being “woke” and have chilled out some.
Christ, finally. The amount I have to twist people’s arms on this website to do the most basic homework to support their positions. It’s completely ridiculous.
That article is very scant on details and specifics. It mentions “defund the police,” which was mostly a slogan used by activists rather than the party, and which, as the article mentions (and as I mentioned previously) never actually went anywhere and was walked back, with Biden calling specifically to “fund the police” and with many places raising police budgets instead. In spite of this, there was a perception that Democrats actually did defund the police. Not the reality.
It doesn’t really talk about democrat’s positions on trans rights at all. It mentions #MeToo, and one random state assemblywoman who talked about cancelling Thanksgiving.
My whole point is not that there was no perception of the Democrats being woke, but that it was just a perception. Nothing in that article actually challenges that. It just quotes other people who had that perception. You can say, “politics is about feelings and perceptions” but all that makes me think of is how Republicans “felt like” Obama turned the country into a socialist republic.
Here is a Ballotpedia page for Hillary Clinton’s stances on LGBT rights in 2016. I would love to know which parts of it are “particularly pro-trans” rather than just keeping the government out of trans people’s business and ensuring equal protection under the law.
I think you’ve blindly accepted this narrative as dogma without any real evidence and anything that happens you could just twist into supporting the narrative. If Talarico and Hamilton had lost, you’d just say that it shows they were too supportive of trans rights, since they won, you say it’s because they weren’t fully supportive of them. Meanwhile, the example of El-Sayed is just written off because he doesn’t fit the narrative you already decided on. It’s nonsense.
Ah, see, there you have it. The community. When people talk about the left going too far, what they mean is almost always like some random Tumblr blog with 10 followers.
Guess what? There are still random Tumblr blogs with 10 followers saying all sorts of crazy things, wielding zero political influence just as they did back then. Fucking, saying crazy shit is part of growing up, part of sorting out ideas, and some of the “crazy shit” that’s taken to represent “the left” is literally just some 15 year old. You’re never going to enforce any kind of “party discipline” across everyone in the country.
What’s changed is not that teenagers suddenly stopped saying crazy shit, or lost the power they never had in the first place, but that the Republicans fucked shit up badly enough that people started having better things to worry about. And to some extent, people have just become more accustomed to the internet and the fact that there are always people saying all kinds of shit and it doesn’t fucking matter. And frankly, the most woke shit by the edgiest teen could barely compete with the shit Elon Musk tweets out regularly to huge audiences anyway.
So, in my opinion, this whole narrative is bullshit based on nothing but memories of perceptions.
Lol, now you’re just making shit up.
As for El Sayed, I’m not saying everybody has gone full anti-woke. I’m just saying the Democratic party has chilled out in general. There’s gonna be exceptions.
Ok
The point is with this sort of narrative that isn’t really based on hard evidence in the first place, virtually anything that happens can be spun to support it, and the inconvenient parts just glossed over. It’s just based on feelings so the only way to refute it is if you just happen to feel differently.
So what you are saying then is that everybody had been woke. Because otherwise, if it’s just that there are some politicians that are woke and some that are anti-woke, and it was like that before, then nothing’s really changed.
But that’s the thing. Not everybody in the party was woke. And if you relied on actual evidence instead of memories and feelings, you’d see that that’s obviously true. If everyone had been woke, that raises the question of why wasn’t there legislation that you can actually point to?
If anything, politicians generally didn’t really talk about trans people or have clearly defined stances, until Republicans decided to make it a central issue of their campaign.
Politics is not always “hard facts” and sometimes it’s just “perception and feelings”. When I saw this meme I had a reaction based on what I have seen over the last 5-10 years. I am one person on the internet. Feel free to ignore me, but also feel free to recognize that I may be representing an opinion shared by many other people that are not commenting on this thread.
I see posts on here all the time and comments on here all the time that collect to give me a perception of the “community”. Along with talking with friends and family. And not only reading headlines about things a politician said, but listening to their actual words. It is not worth it to me to google sources for you for every opinion or perception I have.
You mentioned El Sayed as an example. I saw a headline yesterday praising him for not turning his back on trans people in his 60 minutes interview. I listened to that interview and didn’t hear anything particularly pro trans. He basically said the government doesn’t need to get involved. Which is a great opinion to have.
Do I feel like having it out with you about how “woke” he is as a candidate? Not really. Especially not when it doesn’t matter.
No, that’s not what I’m saying.
That’s literally what the Democrats were saying in “Woke 1.”
I don’t know what “woke 1” is
The time we’re discussing when the Democrats were supposedly “too woke.” They had the same positions then that you call reasonable now.
You just don’t know it because you don’t care about the facts. The Democratic Party was never “particularly pro-trans” beyond the government staying out of people’s business.
I didn’t want to have to google, but you made me. This article seems to be saying many things I am saying. Democrats went to far being “woke” and have chilled out some.
https://archive.ph/FLtUR
Christ, finally. The amount I have to twist people’s arms on this website to do the most basic homework to support their positions. It’s completely ridiculous.
That article is very scant on details and specifics. It mentions “defund the police,” which was mostly a slogan used by activists rather than the party, and which, as the article mentions (and as I mentioned previously) never actually went anywhere and was walked back, with Biden calling specifically to “fund the police” and with many places raising police budgets instead. In spite of this, there was a perception that Democrats actually did defund the police. Not the reality.
It doesn’t really talk about democrat’s positions on trans rights at all. It mentions #MeToo, and one random state assemblywoman who talked about cancelling Thanksgiving.
My whole point is not that there was no perception of the Democrats being woke, but that it was just a perception. Nothing in that article actually challenges that. It just quotes other people who had that perception. You can say, “politics is about feelings and perceptions” but all that makes me think of is how Republicans “felt like” Obama turned the country into a socialist republic.
Here is a Ballotpedia page for Hillary Clinton’s stances on LGBT rights in 2016. I would love to know which parts of it are “particularly pro-trans” rather than just keeping the government out of trans people’s business and ensuring equal protection under the law.