In the US, a vast majority of people vote by party. They may not even know the candidates by name, and simply vote “straight ticket.”
But I was in line to vote a few years ago and overheard someone say something like “yeah I saw more signs for This Guy than for That Guy, so I guess I’ll vote This Guy.”
I have also heard it’s not uncommon for Americans to vote for candidates they think are more attractive, or have a name they like more.
Basically, we’re pathologically stupid
One of he reasons Trump won in the first place was probably that he was a celebrity
Different voters vote differently. This is really testing the limits of the sub IMHO.
How?
because it’s impossible to make general statements about how “people” in general vote; each voter has different motivations for voting
I ment general consensuses. And how does it test the limits of this sub? What rule?
It tests whether there really are no stupid questions.
no stupid questions? no, stupid questions!
They mostly vote by party affiliation. If we could get that R and D off the ballot suddenly, we’d get some really interesting results
Our judges are elected in a “non-partisan” section of the ballot, but when you go to their web pages the party affiliation is prominent. You can take the D or R off the ballot, but not from the politics.
Sure, but honestly how many people actually research their choices? We’re dying because of low information voters turning democracy into a team sport
I’d be happy if you simply had to correctly spell the name of the candidate under the position they’re running for. It’s a really low bar as far as poll tests go, and at least everyone would have to do a minimal amount of research on the election to have their vote count
I think removing the party affiliation is the easier first step. Then you just have to recognize the name of someone you want to vote for.
I will say though, the last time I floated the idea of just removing down ballot voting by party, someone told me that it actually disenfranchises a huge number of voters. Why? In places where there is no law about “at least a X polling places for Y citizens” it increases throughput and lets more people cast ballots.
Yeah, I agree, it’s much lower hanging fruit, and I think it would have a positive affect on the team-sports attitude most voters have
Why? In places where there is no law about “at least a X polling places for Y citizens” it increases throughput and lets more people cast ballots.
This makes no sense to me though… It’s like “if times are tough, we should just prescribe people medicine for every other day”
Like, sure, I’m sure it increases throughput, but at the cost of effectively disenfranchising high information voters.
Our models for democracy are not working. We’re one of the furthest along, but the same corruptive forces are happening in every democracy. I think it’s fundamental that everyone has the right to vote, and that access needs to be universal. But I’m no longer convinced everyone’s vote should count equally - we need to create a better form of democracy
It’s just too easy to manipulate low information voters, and liberal democracy seems to produce a whole lot of bad outcomes - even in countries with less susceptible systems than ours, low information voters are killing us
I think this idea is worth trying, and if we need to widely use mail in voting or open more polling stations, that seems like a really cheap price to pay. It’s not like we’re well enfranchised now… The fact that we don’t have enough polling to serve the voters is a problem in itself
This election aside (which will hopefully be very historical), modern US elections are decided by a shockingly small percentage of the population living in the right place
Much of it is manipulation through crazy districts and voter suppression, but the biggest factor is the fact the majority of active voters are blindly loyal down ballot voters. That predictably is why gerrymandering works - along with the insanely granular data collection and control of information, elections are more like a game of strategy than the will of the people
I know I’m preaching to the choir, but I want you to understand that your desire for improvement is good and correct, and there will always be a million excuses to keep things the same
We need to try things and adapt as we go… There will be problems, but if we keep pressing forward we can find solutions. And it’s much better than guaranteed suffering forever
Our models for democracy are not working. We’re one of the furthest along, but the same corruptive forces are happening in every democracy. I think it’s fundamental that everyone has the right to vote, and that access needs to be universal. But I’m no longer convinced everyone’s vote should count equally - we need to create a better form of democracy
This is exactly it. The system we have worked when all voters were basically on equal footing in terms of ability to find and consume information. This is obviously no longer the case. The problem is, most changes you can make are easy to weaponize. Also, to make any type of change you have to vote for it in the current system where low info voters can be convinced to vote against their own interests anyway.
The problem is, most changes you can make are easy to weaponize.
Yep. That’s why I’m not proposing something like a civics test, any idea has to be simple and straightforward enough that there’s no room to twist it into targeted voter suppression
Also, to make any type of change you have to vote for it in the current system where low info voters can be convinced to vote against their own interests anyway
That’s true, but politics is an ebb and a flow. We’ve passed basically no laws for years now, and (hopefully as we’ll see today) there’s building pressure for change
If we get enough progressives in office, and they answer the call of the people to do something, we’re going to end up with a short period where change is possible.
Hopefully in two years, when Trump is in still in office and progressives have spent the last two years establishing themselves and gaining the trust of the people, we could have a full progressive sweep of Congress and at least a somewhat progressive or sympathetic president
That would open a window, and that will be the chance to make sweeping charges. Probably the only chance in our lifetimes
